A Question on Succession

Mwalimu-G said:
How? I imagine he was a minor just two years ago.
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This boy dropped out of school in form 2. He was expelled for bullying other boys. The dad didn't bother putting him into another school. So amekua akifanya casual jobs here and there. He has on several occasions been accused of stealing other people's chicken. He was the one who would get the dad some cheap alcohol when the dad was bedridden. Yaani, ako na tabia sijawai ona kwa familia yetu.
 
Aviator said:
Imagine you marry a woman with three grown children. Mnazaa kamoja and you name him after your dad.
Then at succession, the big lad, whose blood you have no idea where it comes from, becomes the administrator. And note that in most cases, these bastards aren't the best-behaved.

The law is an ass. Some things.... I kent
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What do you mean by 'grown'?
 
Aviator said:
This boy is 20, I think. In the absence of the father, he obviously takes the upper hand. The other boy, the only legitimate offspring, is barely 7.


Of course. He's not our blood. And he was the dad's partner in crime.


Kwani huyo judge hakuwa African? Anachesa na omera.
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A boy of 20 should never, ever give a grown man sleepless nights. Keg ya 300 unapatokana amedrown mahali....does he even have the wherewithal and knowledge to mount a legal challenge to anything?

Which is why, I repeat, the matter is between the four siblings.

Ask the son to call kikao Cha nyumba. This thing will be resolved by sunset.

( Of course the son would have seen certain influential members nyuma ya tent beforehand).
 
Aviator said:
This boy dropped out of school in form 2. He was expelled for bullying other boys. The dad didn't bother putting him into another school. So amekua akifanya casual jobs here and there. He has on several occasions been accused of stealing other people's chicken. He was the one who would get the dad some cheap alcohol when the dad was bedridden. Yaani, ako na tabia sijawai ona kwa familia yetu.
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@Aviator,
Surely, how does this negate his legal right as a Son and Heir to his Father’s estate?
It is what it is - some people are born lucky and providence place them in situations where they seem, to all intents and purposes, undeserving.

I can assure that if this case ever gets to Court, given the bile and bitterness evident towards this illegitimate Son, his rights will trump everybody else’s and will be concretely protected.

It is hard seeing an illegitimate Son inherit what he seems not to deserve but we must always bear in mind that that is not our property. It is someone else’s and not a loss to us.

My advise to the family would be to do what is right not what is expedient.
If they try to disinherit him, they will all lose.
 
Field Marshal said:
A boy of 20 should never, ever give a grown man sleepless nights. Keg ya 300 unapatokana amedrown mahali....does he even have the wherewithal and knowledge to mount a legal challenge to anything?

Which is why, I repeat, the matter is between the four siblings.

Ask the son to call kikao Cha nyumba. This thing will be resolved by sunset.

( Of course the son would have seen certain influential members nyuma ya tent beforehand).
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Kikao ni Saturday.
Stay tuned.
Tiiga Waana said:
@Aviator,
Surely, how does this negate his legal right as a Son and Heir to his Father’s estate?
It is what it is - some people are born lucky and providence place them in situations where they seem, to all intents and purposes, undeserving.

I can assure that if this case ever gets to Court, given the bile and bitterness evident towards this illegitimate Son, his rights will trump everybody else’s and will be concretely protected.

It is hard seeing an illegitimate Son inherit what he seems not to deserve but we must always bear in mind that that is not our property. It is someone else’s and not a loss to us.

My advise to the family would be to do what is right not what is expedient.
If they try to disinherit him, they will all lose.
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And the boy may still go to his real dad and seek his inheritance.
Talk of one lucky a**hole.
 
Mwalimu-G said:
Quote: "The Constitution says that customary law is protected, but the rules of customary law must be in line with the principles in the Bill of Rights. "

Inheritance rights say boys and girls are equally entitled to inheritance from their parents. Hata wewe bibi yako aendee kanyamu kwao siku ile wazazi watahama (God forbid) just like your married sister atakujia..
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But can't be forced to inherit, anaweza kataa/waive her right.
 
Aviator said:
Kikao ni Saturday.
Stay tuned.

And the boy may still go to his real dad and seek his inheritance.
Talk of one lucky a**hole.
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I always gave you 8 out of 10. But it seems you have more oestrogen than @Tiiga Waana who's here spewing legal crap.

This thing should be solved culturally. Any dissenting voice should be vigorously pursuaded to agree with the general consensus.

Haiyaiii!
 
Aviator said:
So, the wishes of the dad become null and void?
In my place, we value "mugambo" more than the law.

Same with Gìkūyū, but the law is an ass.

Mzee had already assigned everyone, including the daughters a portion. A substantial portion, I must add. 5 acres each. Kijana alipewa Nakuru land that was worth less. The good son got 15.
Now the remaining land is around 40 acres. Pia Kuna ancestral land of 5 acres and some two rent-generating plots. This is what is at stake.
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I would advocate ancestral ipewe vijana with a no sale caveat. The 40acres igawanywe on a proposed pre-agreed formula eg 70/30, ladies wapate 30 since they are married. Probably ladies wakipwewa ayam 90% confident watauza tu. Kama ladies hawataki hivyo igawanywe equally. Rentals preferably ziende kwa vijana. One each not shared tenancy.
 
Field Marshal said:
I always gave you 8 out of 10. But it seems you have more oestrogen than @Tiiga Waana who's here spewing legal crap.

This thing should be solved culturally. Any dissenting voice should be vigorously pursuaded to agree with the general consensus.

Haiyaiii!
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Hii mali ya wazazi ni time bomb itakuchoma na vizazi.
 
Aviator said:
I agree ako na tamaa.
But pia he is just relying on mzees words. But he has to share with his late brother coz he has one blood nephew, hao wengine watatu ni foreign blood.

Sisters ndio naona wanafaa kujitoa. Washapata their 5 acres. Waende kwa mabwana zao.

I will be advising the ladies to keep off and the brother to sell a portion and buy some other land for his late brother and settle them there.
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This is a wrong attitude or approach, the kids are 100% part & parcel of the family with equal rights. What if the brother was barren and he never got a kid of his blood. Like @Field Marshal said prevail on the daughters to waive their right to further proceeds. To facilitate a quick conclusion to the succession.
 
Aviator said:
This boy is 20, I think. In the absence of the father, he obviously takes the upper hand. The other boy, the only legitimate offspring, is barely 7.


Of course. He's not our blood. And he was the dad's partner in crime.


Kwani huyo judge hakuwa African? Anachesa na omera.
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It was a long court case ya 1987. By the way if you know Wambui Otieno mwenye alioa Mbugua fundi wake it was her case and the burial of her husband. Alikataa kugwarwa na Odhis ndio maana kalinuka :LOL::LOL:
 
Field Marshal said:
A boy of 20 should never, ever give a grown man sleepless nights. Keg ya 300 unapatokana amedrown mahali....does he even have the wherewithal and knowledge to mount a legal challenge to anything?

Which is why, I repeat, the matter is between the four siblings.

Ask the son to call kikao Cha nyumba. This thing will be resolved by sunset.

( Of course the son would have seen certain influential members nyuma ya tent beforehand).
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In hindsight they should fairly administer the estate despite all the misbehaviors of the dad and son. Also a caution should be placed on any properties against sale until other dependants are of age.
 
Giggz said:
I would advocate ancestral ipewe vijana with a no sale caveat. The 40acres igawanywe on a proposed pre-agreed formula eg 70/30, ladies wapate 30 since they are married. Probably ladies wakipwewa ayam 90% confident watauza tu. Kama ladies hawataki hivyo igawanywe equally. Rentals preferably ziende kwa vijana. One each not shared tenancy.
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No sale caveat is something I can never do.
Where I live, I see guys living in mabati houses on a 8m+ worth of plot simply because there exists a caveat. That is condemning your generations to poverty.

I however agree with the rest.
 
On the nephew, the law of matrimonial succession 2014 is pretty clear, it's the wife to the late brother who is entitled to her husbands share if the marriage is in such a way that it can't be recognized in law, then the legitimate son/daughter can claim but if he/she isn't of age, then the guardian (mother) can act on her interest. This in future means that the inherited property will belong to the child born by the brother and not the others
 
Aviator said:
Lawyers (and other imenyi) in the house, help me here.

Some relatives are dividing their late parents'wealth. They are 3 girls and 1 boy. A second boy passed on sometime last year, but ako na offsprings.

This late boy was one hell of a character. He was the black ship (sic) of the family. Many years ago, he had taken his dad to the chief demanding his inheritance. The chief of course saw the stupidity of the issue and advised the dad to settle this guy far away since he can be dangerous. The dad did exactly that and sent the boy to a farm he owned in Nakuru. Mpaka akambadilishia tirle. He even built a home for the guy. The guy moved with his family, but sold the land after less than an year. He rented but when the cash ran out, the guy returned back home. By then, the Mzee had allocated half of the land where they stay to the other four siblings. He was also suffering from dementia. He welcomed his son back home with his family. An year later he passed on. The wife, now their mother, passed on early last year. Now they are sharing the wealth.

Here's the kizungumkuti.
1) The remaining son says that before the father lost his mental faculties, he had disowned this other son.
2) That the father had told him that he has sorted the daughter's, and therefore the remaining land, property and cash is his.
3) The daughters argue that they are entitled to an equal share of the remaining wealth, including cash in bank and plots. They say there's no written word to verify above claims.
4) All the four agree that the late son had got his inheritance and therefore has no further claim.
5) A son to the late brother has joined the mix claiming that he is also entitled to the wealth of his grandfather. He argues that the portion given to his late dad cancels with whatever everyone else received. Note that this son is not the blood of the late brother. On fact, out of the four kids the late brother left, only one is his blood.

The family is now at stalemate. They have sought intervention of a few cousins, among them yours truly. I would love to hear your opinion on this issue.

On my side, I would say that in the absence of any written will, the law requires that the property be divided equally into 5 parts. I however think it would be unfair to the late Mzee coz I know for sure he had disowned his son that time he was reported to the chief.
As for the girls, I think they are also being unfair considering they are all married and have husband's who have inherited land from their parents.

But what do I know?
Experts leteni maoni.

Cc @Kasaman @Field Marshal @Mwalimu-G @Meria @Tiiga Waana and all elders of goat
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That is a satanic family...nway:
A sober man subdivides property equally to all children (married daughters can be divorsed so badala ateseke, atarudi kwao na specifically kwake).
If one of his son's is dead then the inheritance goes to the wife and the first born child should be present kama witnesser ..
Grandkids have no claim if their parent had already received his/her inheritance.
Where no will exits, the court will recognize the children before the grandkids.
 
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