Anglututu
Elder Lister
Correction a small bit if crazy ideologists believe in terrorism.
Just Thoughts.. Help me reason
- Thread starter Lalongwe
- Start date
Denis Young
Elder Lister
So are you living as if there is a God so you don't burn in hell or are you living as if there is a God because you actually believe?
Seems to me the person who made that statement is hedging their bets.
bigDog
Elder Lister
Lets throw some spanners in there:
1. You have a god who creates man in his own image. But he forgets to create a woman.
2. He/She/it creates a garden and creates a garden. Goes ahead and dismembers the man off his rib to create a woman and places both in the garden. Forbids them from eating a certain fruit of knowledge.
3. Somehow, a disgraced god's servant rebels and turns into a snake (a gods creation!) and tricks other gods creations to rebel against god.
4. The god is now vengeful and kicks out and curses his own creation.
Assumimg that the god is an ever-knowing, omnipresent being. Consider the following questions:
a). Would a reasonable being create a power that could sabotage him/her/it? E.g. Satan.
b). If the god above was happy with his creation and found it OK, why did he then create a woman?
c). Why did he allow creation errors (bugs) in (a) and (b) lead to a catastrophic system shutdown.
The bible says that the Garden of Eden Project was shut down, the project subjects cursed and expelled. The project manager passed on the failure to his subjects and has never accepted responsibility for it's failure.
Would you hire such a fella as a project manager?
1. You have a god who creates man in his own image. But he forgets to create a woman.
2. He/She/it creates a garden and creates a garden. Goes ahead and dismembers the man off his rib to create a woman and places both in the garden. Forbids them from eating a certain fruit of knowledge.
3. Somehow, a disgraced god's servant rebels and turns into a snake (a gods creation!) and tricks other gods creations to rebel against god.
4. The god is now vengeful and kicks out and curses his own creation.
Assumimg that the god is an ever-knowing, omnipresent being. Consider the following questions:
a). Would a reasonable being create a power that could sabotage him/her/it? E.g. Satan.
b). If the god above was happy with his creation and found it OK, why did he then create a woman?
c). Why did he allow creation errors (bugs) in (a) and (b) lead to a catastrophic system shutdown.
The bible says that the Garden of Eden Project was shut down, the project subjects cursed and expelled. The project manager passed on the failure to his subjects and has never accepted responsibility for it's failure.
Would you hire such a fella as a project manager?
ShakaZulu
Lister
God's plan for you is to give you a fullfilling life way beyond your dreams, that us his purpose. He has everything planned out and knows how to execute it, therefore he knows everything. But there is also the ruler of darkeness, he lies and his purpose is to get you out of the garden of aden (God's purpose). For those that are enlightened and know there is a spiritual life..he either attacks to create fatigue or lies that he is better than God.. Whichever path one takes he cannot surprise God for even Satan himself is under Him and has to seek permission before doing anything. However we cannot pretend to know it all, for instance God saves some people in a tragedy and lets other die...even kids. I think the life we live is a continuous one that originated way before we were born, we are just visitors and death does not mean much.
Burner
Elder Lister
I was a believer. Got "saved" too. There were always doubt though. Then i thought long and hard about why i believed and realised there was no reason i had besides faith.
And faith is not a good reason because you can hold any position based on faith.
For the most part you are correct. So the muslim, christian, mormon, zoroastrian, hindu, space-monster, fairy/pixie belivers all cant be right can they? Because you will find people in all those and hundreds of other belief systems (which frmly contradict each other) who firmly believe their god-belief or whatever is the true one.
So how do you tell which one is true? You cant because as you said, you cant prove a god doesnt exist...but they cant prove theirs does either!
I take exception to darwin in your listing only because i assume you mean the theory of evolution. For which the evidence is mountains high.
Read about the missing link....the evidence is not exactly mountain high
people have been given free will sir, you can relate to whomever you want however you want and it may or may not be related to God's will
Burner
Elder Lister
There is no missing link. The missing link is a term used by people who dont subscribe to evolution and mainly because of that very common image of a chimp->neanderthal-->man walking.
But in any case, even if evolution was proven to completely wrong/false, it does not make the story of creation/intelligent design true.
That has to stand on its own merits and it doesnt.
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neither does it make atheist's to be right in their believe
Burner
Elder Lister
If your God is omniscient and he knows everything you will do before you do it, his will or not, then you do not have free will since your actions are clearly predestined.
The other option is that you have free will but he does know what actions you would take, meaning he is not all knowing.
Burner
Elder Lister
What belief is that? The atheist position only speaks to a belief in a god.
I can be an atheist that believes an elf created the cosmos and died.
and that belief has to stand on its own merits, whether you can proof it or not is another story
you understand it wrongly, liken it to weather and climate.....weather is unpredictable but climate is.....same way you can choose to steal, kill and destroy today, but what happens in future only God knows.
Probably for you, you are an aethist so that God can use you as a tool in future....which is beyond your control but well within Gods control. Probably he is using you right now to impact someone else life.
Burner
Elder Lister
And since i cant prove it, it should not be believed right?
Burner
Elder Lister
This is demonstrably wrong. We have weather and climate forecasts.
And you example still doesn't apply. If your god knows the future, he know im going to steal or destroy today or in the future. He apparently knew exactlt what i'd do before i was born. Meaning i was on this path before i knew it. It only follows that i had no choice in the matter.
now you are getting it. There is a bigger plan than just yourself, the people you meet, the people you interact with....some have bigger destinies than others and you have indeed contributed to a bigger masterplan
It is not right to question yourself that much...you should believe what you feel is right to believe in. It should not be based on other peoples beliefs
Burner
Elder Lister
The fact that you say there is a bigger plan removes any chance of free will. You are just a cog in the machine that has no choice in which way to turn.
Burner
Elder Lister
Its not based on other people's beliefs (which is exactly what all religions are). It is based on simple reasoning. If You have no proof (evidence) to believe x, then you should not believe x.
yes, that is why the bible is there so you can read it yourself and apply your own judgement and reasoning. There are people like you who choose not to believe in the bible but you choose to believe in something else with no proof but just faith